tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post1350700286212476530..comments2023-12-13T05:38:56.001-06:00Comments on Gray Matter: Class Q&A and Blizzcon Follow UpGraylohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12928540421337175942noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-31337630176515122402011-11-23T13:51:06.435-06:002011-11-23T13:51:06.435-06:00I think right now there are very few good examples...I think right now there are very few good examples of hybrid activity that take place within a single fight. The best example in current content would probably be moonkin aiding healers with tranquility at a well-timed moment. <br /><br />The proposed Heart of the Wild builds on the "DPS does healing" aspect by providing another way to boost healing output on a long cooldown. HotW also goes the other way "healing does DPS" by giving resto a way to put out good damage for a short time when there is not a need for high healing and without heavy impact to their mana (normally healers wouldn't DPS even when healing needs are low because they will need the mana later).<br /><br />So HoTW looks ok. What looks BAD is Master ShapeShifter (MSS). MSS does not open up any "hybrid" play. Hybrid in the traditional sense is a class that can perform two of the three roles of the triad heals/DPS/tank, usually one role really well, and the other role competently but only at crucial points during a fight. MSS tries to be clever by mixing physical/melee with range/magic but the bottom line is it is still just DPS. No healing, no tanking. If you are only doing DPS then it is not hybrid, it is just an over-complication of the DPS rotation. <br /><br />If top performance of moonkin OR feral DPS in PVE situations requires heavy use of MSS I would predict there will be a large movement away from these specs because I can't see a way for this to not be incredibly clunky and therefore not fun to play. It almost seems MSS is geared towards PVP since Druid is usually already doing chain shapeshifts in PVP to pull off chain CCs (small scale PVP anyway). MSS will add bonus damage on top of that which will probably be very attractive. Of course by the looks of Disentanglement it sounds like Druid is going to lose the base ability to shift and dispel snares which would probably make Disentanglement the PVP talent of choice. So MSS ends up being a black sheep talent. PVP would take Disentanglement, and die hard PVE moonkin/feral might take it and use it if theory shows it can give teh top numberz but that's about it. Others would move away to another spec because rationally if you cannot play a spec close to optimal while having fun then you switch to another spec.<br /><br />As a last point the idea behind MSS isn't entirely new. During BC moonkin had the practically-useless mechanic of doing melee to regain mana during a fight. I may have used this once during an actual boss fight when I ran out of potions or something. It was useless otherwise, EXCEPT (and this draws back to my points above) in PVP arena situations where moonkin would carry around a 2nd staff with high attack power and take warlock/hunter pets behind a pillar and beat them up for mana. Blizz scrapped the melee/magic mixing idea from then, they shouldn't try to bring it back now.<br /><br />Thedrun, US StormrageAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-16221314172615366512011-11-17T10:01:32.235-06:002011-11-17T10:01:32.235-06:00I understand the whole "hybrid" theory B...I understand the whole "hybrid" theory Blizzard is pushing, but I don't agree with it being as "fluid" as they are aiming for with MoP. For one, I see it being incredibly difficult to balance in PVE and PVP. I can't even imagine how OP this could be in PVP in the right hands if a player could dps as well as a pure class then pop a talent and heal as well as a pure class. I just see balance issues abound with this formula.<br /><br />Secondly, I HATE healing, if I were forced to heal in a raid because I'm a balance druid and have a talent that says, "hey I can off heal" I'd probably reroll to a different class. I don't want to be forced into filling a roll (healing or tanking) that I don't particularity want to fill. The obvious reply here is, "well then don't play a hybrid". My response to this logic is that I've been playing my druid for years now and have been very happy with the separation in specs/rolls. Changing this now disrupts the play style many of us have come to enjoy.Kordanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-39403373236062402342011-11-16T13:04:09.394-06:002011-11-16T13:04:09.394-06:00It's very likely we will have to think about p...It's very likely we will have to think about possible combinations of talents instead of just thinking that every talent should "synergize" with the others.<br /><br />For example, MSS and Wild Charge can work out very good together as mobility tricks with some improvements in melee range. Or Incarnation and Heart of the Wild as CD reliant Druids.<br /><br />The way the talent trees are and the "synergy" between talents once again put us into the choice of some optimal combinations. Yet some of these "OC" can be quite more difficult to play in the practice and can go against one of their objectives of "making classes easier to play".<br /><br />Actually I think they will throw this last objective, seeing what is happening with the "Glyph of Inquisition" of the Paladins as a test run, they might be considering the "harder to play, better the reward" posibility.Kelvin Zevalloshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04300818987137432950noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-58625760227971556052011-11-16T06:39:49.601-06:002011-11-16T06:39:49.601-06:00A lot of druids prime Eclipse by shooting at critt...A lot of druids prime Eclipse by shooting at critters in the instances. With Heart of the Wild, wouldn't moonkin take it and prime before fights by healing? I think that problem alone might be reason enough to not have healing ever interact with Eclipse.lissannahttp://www.restokin.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-55234219183026163252011-11-16T05:13:50.682-06:002011-11-16T05:13:50.682-06:00If they make the talent choices dependant on the r...If they make the talent choices dependant on the raid encounter and the dps equivalent to pure dps classes, the question will be why a raid would bring a mage/rogue instead of a druid.<br />Because if the raid encounter requires an offtank/offhealer at one point in the raid, a hybrid will be the only viable choice. Without a certain enrage timer bringing 3 druidoffhealers will be better than bringing mage/warlock/druid combos.<br />Also, Blizzard is forcing people to play the whole druid instead of a cat OR moonkin OR tree, if they make the change good enough. A druid/shaman/paladin will need a specific specc for a specific encounter and perform very hybridlike the whole time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-72043501695483942252011-11-16T05:10:51.157-06:002011-11-16T05:10:51.157-06:00Slightly off topic but I was thinking about the ab...Slightly off topic but I was thinking about the abilities that automatically switch you into another form (e.g. Cat for a stun etc.)<br /><br />It was mentioned that you were saved 1 gcd from switching into Cat and you only need to waste 1 switching back into Moonkin.<br /><br />BUT if you are resto then you would even waste one switching back as use automatically switch out when you use a healing spell.<br /><br />As this means resto gets all those abilities for 'free' (in terms of lost gcds) do you think the loss of moonkin form (or changed to become a dps cd - my prefered option out of the two) might be on the cards?<br /><br />I do like moonkin form but it would be nice if it acually did something special rather than a static buff, same goes for shadow priests I guess.Dartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-2381119745366067452011-11-16T03:14:13.093-06:002011-11-16T03:14:13.093-06:00"We don't intend for that added hybridiza..."We don't intend for that added hybridization to be offset by any sort of DPS nerf. While DPSing, a druid's DPS will be entirely competitive with other DPS. We hope to see druids that do things like, "DPS in Cat Form most of the fight, but during one phase, when healing is super difficult, pop out of Cat, hit Heart of the Wild, Tranquility, and spam heals on the raid to help top everyone off, then go back to Cat and resume DPSing."<br /><br />So are they going to make raids with the intention of forcing druids to do this? Don't even know where they are try to go with this load of trash. The whole talent system appears terrible, I guess we'll find out. Rogue tears about not getting Prep AND Shadowstep might be the only reason I'll play MoP. Then again we are talking about rogues, they'll just get another OP ability so meh.Tjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15271234801535822974noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-71241555592298527192011-11-15T19:06:16.892-06:002011-11-15T19:06:16.892-06:00Not sure I get this quote:
"If Master Shapes...Not sure I get this quote:<br /><br />"If Master Shapeshifter provides a significant DPS buff then, no one would take Heart of the Wild or Disentanglement, because that would tell all of the other players and potential guilds that "Hey, I'm a bad player." And no, one wants to think that they are a bad player or to tell other players that they are bad."<br /><br />If the new talent system is just going to be like a beefed up glyph system, then there may be fights where it's beneficial for a Moonkin to pick up HotW for the extra healing (assuming this gets fixed per your worries).<br /><br />For other fights where dps is at more of a premium they can pick up MSS because it will let them do better DPS during times when they wouldn't be able to otherwise do as much damage or deliver dps in a more useful way than they normally would (bursty, mobile dps for moonkin, ranged dps for cats). Hitting that sweet spot just requires blizz to get the numbers right in terms of how the MSS buff works for each dps spec.<br /><br />For other fights you can pick up Disentanglement to help recover from your own mistakes without over taxing healers (thinking engulfing flames during p3 rag, for example).<br /><br />That type of talent switching seems as inevitable as the current glyph system, which doesn't bother me at all.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-60159498361014285352011-11-15T15:16:27.141-06:002011-11-15T15:16:27.141-06:00My main complaint about the hybrid talents is that...My main complaint about the hybrid talents is that they are on the last tier. Hybrid play is most prominent in leveling dungeons. If you really know the class, you can even play a role that you aren't specced for in the slightest. So it would make more sense to put the hybrid talents as the first tier rather than the last.<br /><br />Beware the balance issues, though! As you point out, it will be very tempting to bring dps druids who can cast tranquility during the rough spots of a raid. Unless other classes have something similar to bring to the table, druids will end up being preferred.<br /><br />My favorite solution is to make hybrid play something you do in emergencies and in content you overgear. That would address the balance issue, and it would also solve the problem that overgeared content is extremely boring for healers, moreso than other roles.Ohkenhttp://shiftingnature.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.com