tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post2983916105808622354..comments2023-12-13T05:38:56.001-06:00Comments on Gray Matter: Blue Post: Haste and the GCDGraylohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12928540421337175942noreply@blogger.comBlogger23125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-44867434234644208232009-10-27T18:25:24.777-05:002009-10-27T18:25:24.777-05:00What if they do a talent that says like 'when ...What if they do a talent that says like 'when you cast Moonfire for the next N seconds your wrath's cast time is increased by 0.5 sec and starfire cast time is reduced by N (0.5??) sec' it would both resolve the scaling isse and address the dps problems i heard of. No i'm not a mmonkin, not even a druid.Rhuarchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05669841591271703023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-72475866277989784682009-10-26T12:59:23.690-05:002009-10-26T12:59:23.690-05:00@Beastious - excellent idea, and it fits very well...@Beastious - excellent idea, and it fits very well into the vien that Blizzard has taken with Wrath and SF in the past.<br /><br />Another option; change NG to increase the spell haste on SF and all restoration spells by 20% and reduce the cast time of wrath to 0(instant). That eliminates your GCD issue as well as provides us with additional functionality and mobility.<br /><br />Yet another option is to change imp Moonfire to allow both of our DOTs to crit, then change 2pT9 to increase the chance by 15% or whatever. This would allow us to value crit more heavily then haste... but it does not address the root of the problem.Darkcanuck99noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-15987246521094498082009-10-24T08:09:12.840-05:002009-10-24T08:09:12.840-05:00Don't know if anyone has posted this idea:
St...Don't know if anyone has posted this idea:<br /><br />Starlight Wrath<br />5/5<br />Reduces the cast time of your Starfire spell by 0.5 sec. Increases your Wrath spell damage by 30%.<br /><br />Each point - 0.1 sec / 6% damage.<br /><br />No glyph needed, no change in wrath base cast time. Just change the talent already there.Beastiousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-58588691425441786702009-10-23T04:21:52.953-05:002009-10-23T04:21:52.953-05:00I second the motion to create the big red boomkin ...I second the motion to create the big red boomkin button. Best feature ever. Until another class gets their own big red button, but hey at least we will be first.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-36158463252074873212009-10-22T11:10:54.445-05:002009-10-22T11:10:54.445-05:00I say - leave everything the way it is and give al...I say - leave everything the way it is and give all Boomkins a big red button. <br /><br />The button can be used once per 48 hours, but when it is pressed in any fight, all creatures, regardless of levels, etc, die immediately. Including our own guild mates. And loot can only be obtained and used by the "lone-standing" boomkin. <br /><br />IMOAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-29137337631330964312009-10-21T23:48:29.182-05:002009-10-21T23:48:29.182-05:00Increasing Wrath cast time is a step in the wrong ...Increasing Wrath cast time is a step in the wrong direction; or more accurately takes it one or two steps closer to just being a green wiggly version of Starfire in the nature tree. We have two nukes that they tried to make roughly equal to each other. One scales poorly, the other one doesn't. Even when they balanced it out they've still given us two nukes that don't add unique debuffs or rotational advantages outside of Eclipse.<br /><br />Outside of Eclipse, which is a contrivance of WotLK that we'd all be amused to see go away, there isn't really a reason to have THESE two nukes.Serawyn @ Dethecusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-56203581597256280072009-10-21T21:28:30.771-05:002009-10-21T21:28:30.771-05:00The Devs have said that Wrath and Starfire are too...The Devs have said that Wrath and Starfire are too similar, so I think changing one of the spells, Wrath, would be the best bet. <br /><br />My suggestion:<br />Let's increase the cast time on wrath by 0.5 seconds and give it a secondary effect. For example, your Wrath casts add xx seconds to your Insect Swarm application. This can work because at some point your going to have to cast Starfire because of Eclipse and it will get to burn down the extra seconds you added to it. <br /><br />I wouldn't put a cap on how many seconds you could keep adding to IS. If Wrath was 2 seconds talented, then the IS increased application would have to be at least 3. Of course the loss of Wrath DPS from the added 0.5 second, would be partially compensated by the ability, and if those numbers look like a nerf, we could increase the damage on IS a little to make up for it as well. <br /><br />Maybe Graylo can put some numbers to this to see if it's reasonable.I will if I get a chance to in the near future. <br /><br />Eruantien<br />Ravencrest, US<br />TideEruantienhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14205262184444873504noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-41306710211107456002009-10-21T19:11:47.450-05:002009-10-21T19:11:47.450-05:00@Beamz...
I often find myself not wanting to spam ...@Beamz...<br />I often find myself not wanting to spam hurricane in heroics if I'm unlucky with OoC procs, and so my dps lingers behind the melee, with their cheap burst aoe abilities. A starfire cleave could be a great option to increase our dps in heroics (not that they matter, but just a thought).<br /><br />Having said that... what about nearby CC? or targets that the tank has no threat on? I'd be wary of any uncontrollable aoe abilities (unless the cleave is no-threat, like lightning overload, and won't target CC).<br /><br />The other issue with this is that if Blizzard had to balance starfire around a cleave-like ability, then it would have a reduced single-target damage, and thus would be a nerf.<br /><br />I don't have any suggestions of my own.Tulvelinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-39968921599590783052009-10-21T12:14:57.333-05:002009-10-21T12:14:57.333-05:00I think everyone, including the devs, agrees that ...I think everyone, including the devs, agrees that W and S are too similar as they exist now. But while increasing the cast time of W is a solid way of making the haste stat useful, it blurs the spell distinctions even more. The conundrum sparks two thoughts in my mind:<br /><br />1) We know that haste is being taken off gear in Cataclysm and the stat will be altered in a different manner. How much can they play with the current imbalance before the devs run into problems with the new system for the expansion's scaling?<br /><br />2) I think the spells need more differentiation. A random suggestion is that Starfire become a cleave spell that hits up to 2 additional targets for 50% of the primary target damage. Wrath can have a DoT like ignite added to it or have the spell leave a 1-2 charge residual debuff that makes your next Starfire hit for double. <br /><br />Come up with your own way to differentiate the spells, too, because its time for an overhaul.Beamznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-64559047259596882632009-10-21T11:09:18.479-05:002009-10-21T11:09:18.479-05:00I think the biggest issues are that the talent tha...I think the biggest issues are that the talent that reduces wrath cast time also reduces starfire at the same time (so you can't skip it), and it's a t1 balance talent, so altering it for raiding moonkins will affect resto, pvp, and hybrid builds. It's a house of cards situation.<br /><br />To fix the haste/wrath problem with raiding moonkins, we have to do it deeper into the balance tree in a way that doesn't "undo" the cast time reduction in t1 balance tree.<br /><br />My suggestion would be to nerf the haste from celestial focus by a percent and bump damage 1%ish separately in a talent that both pvp and pve moonkins take (but not resto druids).<br /><br />I think the issue is that it's actually frustrating with t8/t9 gear to suppress your haste rating.. you have to do a lot of regemming, passing on gear that has too much haste, etc. We already do that with hit rating, but so does everyone else and that's the one stat that has a hard number that you have to meet.Duskstormnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-28582001028230382002009-10-21T10:09:46.436-05:002009-10-21T10:09:46.436-05:00Nice blog, has got me thinking alot about Wrath.
...Nice blog, has got me thinking alot about Wrath.<br /><br />Rather than raise the cast time, and in turn damage done (to keep DPET the same), perhaps an overhaul of the spell would be an idea?<br /><br />Make it a channelled spell such as Mindflay for example? The individual ticks still have the same mechanics regarding proccing Lunar eclipse, and GCD clipping will not be an issue.<br /><br />We'll then gain full benefit of BL regardless of which eclipse we happen to be in, and will change our playstyle a wee bit.<br /><br />Ofc this will have to be delicately balanced, but I'm sure it could be worked out.Gammonflapsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-60617036649894212932009-10-21T09:26:49.399-05:002009-10-21T09:26:49.399-05:00The fact that we cap out at a certain level of has...The fact that we cap out at a certain level of haste is part of what makes Moonkin at least mildly distinct from being Leather Wearing fire mages. I don't really want us to become another "stack haste end game" caster class, like Mages, Warlocks, and soon to be Priests.QuestionChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02941191259968297136noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-5042067198662990222009-10-21T09:15:05.088-05:002009-10-21T09:15:05.088-05:00Warlocks scale terrible with crit. We are the only...Warlocks scale terrible with crit. We are the only class which doesn't have anything benefitial attached to a crit (Nature's Grace, more than 100% bonus dmg, instant additional lightning bolt, ...). Destro get 6 % more dmg if conflagrate crits, which is diminished by the talent that increases conflagrate's crit chance by 25%. The pet, which is about 10% of our damage, does not scale with crit (and haste) which lowers the value of crit (and haste) even more.<br /><br />Destro Warlocks also have to sacrifice a glyph to make Conflagrate usable. If the spell consumes the Immolate effect it's completely useless in it's current form. We use conflagrate, life tap and incinerate. Glyph of Immolate (10% to Immolate, 10% to Conflagrate) cannot be used but would be a nice glyph. Same is true for Glyph of Imp. We actually would have more then 3 good glyphs. :-)<br /><br />Destro Warlocks drop under 1s cast time for Immolate when backdrafted and can easily drop under 1s cast time for Incinerate while under heroism and backdraft.<br /><br />These are not real arguments, you just have to compensate otherwise.<br /><br />The DPS in the end is what counts and not the scaling with a specific stat. Although it's hard to compete with classes that scale perfectly with every stat (arcan/fire/ffb mages).Kringhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03128630042421602039noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-9129979762108818322009-10-21T08:54:20.779-05:002009-10-21T08:54:20.779-05:00There are two other possible solutions. One Ghostc...There are two other possible solutions. One Ghostcrawler touched on himself, which is reducing the effectiveness of haste rating so that you may still benefit from it in higher levels. Stat inflation is a massive issue in WoW in many areas and I think Blizzard could do worse than try and reign in some of the biggest offenders.<br /><br />The other option is to remove haste from gear altogether. A bit drastic, I admit, but Rohan makes a good case for it at Blessing of Kings: http://blessingofkings.blogspot.com/2009/10/spell-haste-bad-for-game.htmlMerlothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12268596977879215079noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-86935264343347352009-10-21T08:32:32.967-05:002009-10-21T08:32:32.967-05:00the issue here is scaling..
it cannot be fixed wi...the issue here is scaling..<br /><br />it cannot be fixed with a glyph<br />it cannot be covered by <br />ANOTHER RNG proc<br /><br />increasing wrath cast time is a heavy nurf (especially for lower geared or leveling boomkins) unless u boost the dmg it doesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-57421385257069007932009-10-21T07:19:33.227-05:002009-10-21T07:19:33.227-05:00I have quite high latency ~400ms 'cause I play...I have quite high latency ~400ms 'cause I play on a US server but live in Europe.<br /><br />I dislike the wrath clipping issue because the spell queueing only seems to allow 1 spell in the queue ... but not if the casting is clipped .. and due to my lag I think I'm worse off than people closer to the servers.<br /><br />Is it bad if they did something about spell queuing so that it doesn't clip?<br /><br /> ... say if I spam wrath twice ...why doesn't it just get cast twice via spell queuing? <br /><br />Sure we would still clip and not get much benefit from additional haste if we were clipping, but it would be less of a pain ?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-68729313060815196462009-10-20T22:19:56.134-05:002009-10-20T22:19:56.134-05:00If you nerf Natures Grace you will hurt resto... u...If you nerf Natures Grace you will hurt resto... unfortunately....Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-81562418549978932432009-10-20T17:24:12.140-05:002009-10-20T17:24:12.140-05:00My objection to increasing the cast time through a...My objection to increasing the cast time through a glyph is that we ALREADY spend 5 talent points to lower it. So, we're wasting both talent points and a glyph slot if you leave the same talents but add a glyph to undo what we spent talent points on.<br /><br />If you just changed the tier 1 talent point to buff damage instead of reduce the cast time, you really hurt moonkin PvP that relies on the lower cast time. You'd have to move that cast time lowering somewhere else, and Nature's Grace would still manage to cause problems, but just at a slightly higher haste cap... and there wouldn't be much of a difference for switching between a 2 second spell and a 2.5 second spell...<br /><br />Just nerfing Nature's Grace (but buffing damage some other way) is a better solution all the way around until they can add new spells to our PvE rotation.lissannahttp://restokin.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-59098324040933236912009-10-20T17:05:21.756-05:002009-10-20T17:05:21.756-05:00I like the idea to change the casting time but why...I like the idea to change the casting time but why use a glyph?<br /><br />Change the talent that reduces cast time of wrath to instead increase damage.<br /><br />Then the proc rate of eclipse may be adjusted for wrath's new cast time.Tasknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-70389244621078156212009-10-20T15:31:01.639-05:002009-10-20T15:31:01.639-05:00What is diferenciating Wrath from Starfire if you ...What is diferenciating Wrath from Starfire if you increase the cast time. They are already similar nukes and increasing cast time would make it Starfire (Wrathfire) with nature damage.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-26195497815533262152009-10-20T15:20:24.010-05:002009-10-20T15:20:24.010-05:00Wrath does have a base cast time of 2.0. Its a ta...Wrath does have a base cast time of 2.0. Its a talent that drops it to 1.5. Its a talent that is not skipable in any balance build.Puccnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-27164061238664214212009-10-20T13:56:25.618-05:002009-10-20T13:56:25.618-05:00why not simply give wrath a base cast time of 2.0 ...why not simply give wrath a base cast time of 2.0 seconds and increse it's damage by 33% without a glyph? Just change the base spell.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3232240169123589462.post-15952540763865677132009-10-20T13:49:16.796-05:002009-10-20T13:49:16.796-05:00Leaving haste the way it is and allowing moonkin d...Leaving haste the way it is and allowing moonkin dps to be buffed in another area is unacceptable imo. Having a main nuke going below 1 second is not only not adding DPS, it causes spell queueing to stop working, and decreases DPS. Also, left alone, heroism/bloodlust continue to provide no benefit for wrath.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com